fsb99

My Travelink mysteriously started working a few days ago (not paying for that service), anyone else notice this?

Yes mine expired 6 months ago and started working again last week. Sirius radio works again even though it tells you that subscription is out. I'm guessing they are trying to get more subscribers by giving us free service for a short period of time. Not gonna work with me. Travelink is good for work commute but not essential and I can do with local FM radio or my flash drive mp3's

Not having my books near by doesn't the Hybrid parts come with there own warranty that is a lot more than the car warranty? I'm thinking like 7 yrs and 100K for those components.

Hybrid unique components warranty...Most states: 8/100k. California and possibly handful of other states: 10/150k.

The hybrid components (including the HV cables) are covered under the hybrid components warranty which is considerably longer than the bumper to bumper warranty. I hope the dealer did not sell you an extended warranty based on the fear of a hybrid component failure. In the US the hybrid component warranty is 8 years / 100,000 miles.

 

Just to be clear though I purchased the extended warranty. I purchased it because I got a pretty good deal and have the NAV system. THAT stuff is expensive to repair.

 

Jon

And if you're in California (maybe a few other states) the hybrid warranty is 10/150k. I also bought the extended warranty due to reasonable price and have 502a package.

Ordered one in Silver with Stone leather interior. I think the wife would have preferred Gray with a grey interior but no grey leather available. Did not want a black interior! Cars get hot enough in the dry summers out here.

 

I'll be tracking everybody else's order and looking for turnaround time on orders. I'm already pushing my dealer for a copy of the Order Acknowledgement. Nothing yet. They got all my info with the first couple of inter-dealership offers that fell through.

Unless the ordering manager is not present for whatever reason, you should have gotten your DORA no later than the next business day. The longer it takes for you to get your DORA, this is lag time wasted because your order is not anywhere in Ford queue.

I certainly don't live in a hot market by comparison. I live in the greater Houston area and I suspect that hybrids here are no where near the demand and market saturation levels of southern California. I'm intrigued by the path you describe above in contacting the individual dealers and asking for the internet sales managers for the best deals.

 

Did you obain the invoice costs online from Edmunds or some other website and then submit your offers in writing to the dealerships or were the discussions entirely over the phone and you then had the agreement reduced to writing via email or facsimile?

 

Sorry for the numerous questions, I just feel like there is so much I can learn from you guys.

Yes, I got invoice pricing from either kbb.com, cars.com or edmunds.com. The reported invoice prices reported matched each other so I figured they were fairly accurate. I took a print of the invoice price with all options I wanted and took it to the dealer...they offered $1,000 over invoice with $1,000 non refundable deposit. From their quote, I knew that the reported invoice and actual dealer's invoice was pretty close, but not exact. I couldn't compare item by item because the dealer would not let me have the printout if I didn't put down a deposit.

With the $1,000 over invoice as a maximum price, I searched the internet for dealers within 15 miles and had one FFH in stock so I can test drive it (fairly rare since FFH's were just showing up in showrooms). I called three dealers that had it and asked for internet sales. I told them what I wanted and asked for their email so I can send the pdf's of my specs (with invoice pricing info). I also told them that I got an offer for $500 over invoice already (small gamble on my part). First one said they may be able to beat (didn't turn out to be true), second said that it's not likely I can get a better offer (this is the dealer I got the FFH from - salesperson talked to GM and found out it doesn't count towards allocation and therefore can offer $250 over. Remember this was following some of the worst sales months for Ford, late 2008 to early 2009). Third did not even respond.

Once we agreed on a price, I showed up to their lot, test drove a tri-coat 501A and put down a deposit for the order. They had a second one that they sold to Boeing before I came (probably on the lot for no more than a few days).

Wow. Thanks all for your very substantive responses above. This is really great info.

 

fsb 99: I understand from your post that the deposit amount varys between $500 - $1,000 depending on the dealer. Whether the deposit is refundable or not is also dealer specific. Its interesting that you decided to not do business with the dealership that requested a nonrefundalbe deposit - I hadn't thought of this. If for any reason I don't get a good vibe from one dealer or the terms are not to my liking I should shop around. Thanks for the info. Quick question, did Ford take care of those software glitches?

 

dogo88: I'm a member of two credit unions which have preferred dealership arrangements that I believe are similar to what you've described above; I'll make sure to include those in my search as well. You mentioned you ordered the white, was it the tricoat or the white suede. My wife is in love with the tricoat however I'm uncertain if I want to part with the upcharge fee for the tricoat paint. If it was the tricoat, can you tell me why you choose that color and how it has held up in the brief period you've had the car (less than a year)?

 

Again, thanks all for your responses to date.

Hi Texlaker,

I'll try to make my long story short. I walked into the dealer that wanted the $1,000 non-refundable deposit and got a price of $1,000 over invoice. I also called several dealers and asked for internet sales rep for pricing info. The best one was $250 over invoice with a $500 refundable deposit in writing so I went with them. I live in a hot hybrid market (LA/Orange County) and the reason they were willing to go so low is that ordering the vehicle (FFH tri-coat white with 502A) does not count towards their allocation. I also ordered it around the time they started rolling into dealerships, so it's possible that this one dealer did not know how hot it was going to get (told me later that they weren't accepting orders unless customer is willing to pay $1,000 over invoice).

I ordered on 3/30/09 and took delivery on 5/22/09. Turbo Tax calculated my $3400 tax credit correctly (waiting for my refund). During the time I waited for my FFH, I researched the internet for reviews and most importantly, end user comments, especially from this site. If I didn't like what I heard, I could back out, get my money back, and the dealer could sell my vehicle for a higher price. Everybody wins! I was more confident that this is the vehicle for me after my research (I NEVER thought I'd buy a Ford!)

As far as the glitches, I've experienced the dash reset and rear defroster glitch - both of which I posted here. The dash reset ,also reported by others here, happened twice and last time it was when my FFH was at 3,500 miles. It is now at 10,000+ miles. Rear defroster happened only once and I haven't heard of any other users with the same complaint. I haven't seen it since the first time, but I don't use the defroster often. Last few times I needed it, it worked fine. Re-starting the car is the fix, when the issue appears.

My tri-coat appears to stand up well in the past year. It is in an uncovered parking lot when I'm at work and in the garage when I'm home. I figure that the extra money I paid for it may help resale value due to better paint condition.

Hi all.

 

I recently joined this forum as my wife and I are seriously considering purchasing a Ford Fusion Hybrid or its cousin the Mercury Milan Hybrid. (The wife prefers the Milan Hybrid whereas I am somewhat undecided between the two). In any event, regardless of which vehicle we choose to go with we do have a consensus on our preference to place an order for the vehicle rather than purchasing the dealer stock. Our prior two car buying experiences consisted simply of purchasing the dealer stock so we are somewhat apprehensive about the whole ordering process. I'd rather have as much info as possible on the process before raising it with the dealership because I don't want to seem like a lemming ready to be exploited based on my ignorance. Therefore, if possible, I'd like to solicit some info from you guys and gals on the whole ordering process. For example, I understand from viewing the posts here that there is a deposit required to place an order. Can anyone tell me the amount of the deposit? Does the amount of the deposit vary if it is Ford or Mercury vehicle? Is the deposit refundable? Is there a sales contract executed at the time of the order and submission of the deposit? Is there a difference in users' perception of the willingness of dealers to negotiate on the price if it is a stock vehicle as opposed to an order? How long is the expected production and delivery dates for the hybrids - any difference between Fusion and Milan?

 

Thanks in advance for any responses to my questions. My wife and I are very excited about this whole process and we certainly would appreciate any input to assist in our decision making process.

UPDATED to finish my thought on one of the questions - got distracted

Can anyone tell me the amount of the deposit? Probably dealer dependent - mine was $500, maybe some wants $1000

Does the amount of the deposit vary if it is Ford or Mercury vehicle? - maybe more dealer dependent

Is the deposit refundable? Yes, but get it in writing. I did and they have no problem with that. One other dealer I went to wanted $1000 non-refundable - I didn't go with them

Is there a sales contract executed at the time of the order and submission of the deposit? No, but you have the price negotiated already and get it in writing. They need your driver's license, credit report and deposit

Is there a difference in users' perception of the willingness of dealers to negotiate on the price if it is a stock vehicle as opposed to an order? Maybe, depending on how market conditions are. My order did not count towards allocation so they were willing to give me better pricing.

How long is the expected production and delivery dates for the hybrids - any difference between Fusion and Milan? Milan may have longer lead time - more limited and probably production schedule impacted

I have had the FFH for almost 1 year with no real issues. Some minor (appear to be software) glitches I've mentioned here, but nothing to be too overly concerned about.

After my 5th display glitch, I went to a new dealer.

According to the hybrid technician there, It turns out Ford issued a TSB recently for the Display in early April?

He couldn't tell me what exactly the TSB was for as Ford's support website that the dealer used was off-line.

 

He installed the TSB fix - which if I recall correctly, pretty much was a new installation of the Display Software Module.

 

No issues since.

I was able to drive the car to the LOW TANK warning came on....(more on this below)

 

It's possible that I missed this subtlety before (but I don't think so), but now I do notice the the Efficiency Bar Display has a new feature. There is a semi-transparent white horizontal line that cuts across all the bars...This white horizontal line corresponts to the AVERAGE MPG at the time and will move up or down as your Ave MPG changes. So if your Average MPG is 40 then the horizontal line will hit the 40mpg mark on the Instantaneous MPG. With a new tank of gas and the Average MPG being reset (this time by me), you can see this horizontal bar move up and down relatively quickly as the Average MPG is changing relatively rapidly.

 

 

The white average line has always been there for me...my FFH was built in May 2009 (took delivery end of May 2009).

So it appears you have to get the 501a package to get tri-coat white on the Hybrid. Strange. That's the first time I can remember a paint color being tied to an option package.

I have the Tri-coat White with 502A. Only the 500A does not come in the Tri-coat White. Maybe Ford doesn't think that those wanting the bare-bones model do not want to spend an extra ~$500 on paint.

My wife thinks I am uber geek when I pull this stuff. "What is it with men and numbers?" I don't have a good answer. It's just cool.

 

Congrats on 746 miles to E. Now you have me wondering what the "record" is. There is something liberating about having this kind of range.

This is probably the record:

http://jalopnik.com/5230870/nascar-star-drives-ford-fusion-hybrid-slowly-gets-14457-miles-on-single-gas-tank

Yeah I bought mine in May '09 and have had similiar problems with my Left sensor staying on or reporting "blocked". But it's only happened a few times and I think it mostly correlates to curbed medians, even when I'm stopped at a traffic light.

I'm pretty sure what's happening here is that the radio frequency (RF) signal BLIS transmitted is being reflected back (by a median etc) into the receiver and interfering with the system. I'm guessing the BLIS system reports this as "blocked" after prolonged condition. I've seen this happen once in my FFH on the freeway when I was in the carpool lane (freeway divider to my left).

Other causes of interference could be spurious RF in the same frequency (may or may not be FCC violation, depending on application)

 

I am not buying the run away Prius story for a minute, however that guy has to be a total moron to perform this hoax. He could be facing some serious charges if it was all made up.

 

I'm not sure which side to believe on this one...seems like both sides have credibility issue, but there are plenty of attention hungry morons out there...look up "balloon boy"

In your financial equation, don't forget the $850 tax credit on a new one.

 

Ask the service advisor at the dealership to run an OASIS report on the VIN of the car you are considering and request the warranty history (Just to see if it had big problems.)

Minor point but maybe there are some differences in maintenance also. For example, due to regenerative braking, you may save some $$ by not having to change your brake pads/turn rotors as often as a non-hybrid.

Also, hybrids may qualify for smog check exemptions.

Agreed. Seems like the major additional components that are covered with the Premium Care are electronic including the Nav, audio and display systems. My thinking has generally been that 3 years factory warranty is enough to shake out problems with these components and it has been problem free for 3 years it isn't likely going to fail in years 4 or 5.

 

It's always a bit of a gamble, but my guess is Ford makes a lot of money on these warranties; otherwise they wouldn't offer them.

 

So I'm leaning away from buying the extra coverage for now unless I can get the dealer to sweeten the price a bit.

 

If anyone else has any thoughts ... pls post.

I guess I decided to get PremiumCARE 7/100k $50 deductible for a few reasons, not in any particular order:

- Price was OK - found for $1200 vs my dealer's offer of $2400 (definitely not worth it at that price)

- Many electronics on this vehicle, which can be expensive to repair - some may not be heavily road tested (I would never buy extended warranty for home electronics, but these are exposed to vibrations and climate changes, among other things).

- Ford has a $100 surcharge after 12 months, a $200 surcharge after 24 months to buy this warranty - I look at it as an increase in my "investment"

- If I want to sell this car in 3-4 years, I should be able to recoup most of my warranty cost as added value to the used car

- As someone mentioned here before, the $50 deductible is a sweet spot because it enables me to afford minor repairs prior to selling the car or get my original investment back

- Peace of mind

Just my opinion.

Having owned my 2010 Fusion Hybrid for almost 2 months, I'm wondering if other Hybrid owners would have similar observations:

 

- I find that it takes a very light touch on the gas pedal to keep it in EV mode; any sudden pressure or load demand (going up a hill) switches over to gas motor.

- once the systems have warmed up, the easiest way to get into EV mode is to accelerate to the desired speed (say 30mph) and let off the accelerator, then gently

keep up the speed in EV mode

- I've had it up to 40mph in EV mode, but no higher (maybe downhill?)

 

Any comments/additions would be welcome.

Do you have your dash set to Empower? If so, you can see exactly how much you can depress the accelerator before going into ICE. Bullet 2 is about right. I have no problems going up to 47mph on EV if I really want to (sometimes takes a lot of patience), especially using Empower - available battery charge has a lot to do with this and bullet 1.

Ford cannot identify the issue. Let them drive the car with the "black box" for a few weeks.

This was my thought. Did you propose this to the Ford rep? Just tell them you don't feel safe in the vehicle and like suggested, mention that you are going to contact a local news station. I'm sure that will get their attention. Car safety is a very hot topic. Ask for a temporary FFH loaner. I bet it will change your experience greatly. I may be assuming too much here, but seems to me that Ford would benefit from troubleshooting and fixing this problem - let them do the "experimenting." As you said, it happens fairly often so they should see it almost right away.

Speaking of the glove box...has anyone figured out what the opening that goes to nowhere on the lower right side of the glovebox opening is for on the 2010 Fusion? Even the salesperson didn't know and couldn't figure it out. I'm just curious.

 

Also, if you park anywhere dry leaves or pine needles, etc. fall on the cowl, check your cabin air filter every 60 days or so. I had a filter plug up with dried leaf fragments because of where the car was parked in that time. FYI.

Are you asking about the vertical slot on the right? That's supposed to hold cd jewel cases, I think.

Then again, sometimes they pay out. Twice I had a good deal on them, the first was on a 92 Crown Vic, the fuel pump went out and took out the wiring harness in the trunk, that along with a leaking oil pan gasket, the repairs came out to $2500, I paid $1200 for the warranty, WIN! The other one was an ESP from Toyota on a 2007 Prius. I didn't know much about the prius, it was a from the hip purchase, only car on the lot, 3 miles on it, last day of 2.9% and it gets 50 MPG, so I bought it(the next day my son was born), since it was pretty much all electronic, and thought I would have it a while, I got the ESP, for $1900, then the next day found I can get it for $800, so I called to cancel, instead got a $1200 check back from the dealer, WIN, never used it, found out 10 months later the car was too small for us with two car seats and a tweenager, and traded it on a Veracruz, got more than I owed on it, WIN, then called to cancel the policy, and got back another $1400, WINWINWIN!!! I would say that $1400 was a good deal.

I guess the Prius ESP buy was a complete WIN...was there an option to trade in the Prius with the warranty in place - for more money? I guess you got more money doing it your way, but just wondering.

My issue with Sirius when it ran out was not the monthly fee. It was the ability to cancel. There are a ton of horror stories of folks getting sent to collections even after they thought they had canceled their Sirius subscription. I didn't need the headache nor the aggravation of trying to get my money back from them. And while a lifetime subscription may seem like a solution, the prices weren't that great and it's only for the lifetime of the receiver in the car.

 

Dan

I'm sure there are things you can do to cancel...file a dispute with credit card company, cancel the credit card, send a certified letter, etc to protect yourself. But you're right, too much hassle for marginal value. I really hate that type of tactic so I'll continue to live without it.

I traded a TCH for a Fusion Sport(couldnt make a decent payment amount on the FFH ), but the Fusion hands down is far above the Camry in quality, comfort, styling and handling. Ford built a great car and it pisses me off to no end when you see it ranked so low just about everywhere, except in owner reviews. On Edmunds, the Fusion ranks at 9.2, the Camry 8.5, the Accord 8.9. These are reviews by the owners of the cars. If that doesn't show bias, I don't know what does.

 

BTW my FORD accelerates only when I STEP on the gas!

Yes I agree that the review are biased but Camry and Accord owners also represented so all is fair. Also, owners with bad experience are more likely to voice opinions than ones that are (more or less) happy with their cars.

Read into it a bit more and see what they are really saying.

 

67% off for 3 months, after 3 months you pay more. 60% off for 6 months, after 6 months you pay more, and 50% off for 12 months. When you add it all up, the Quarterly will cost more in the long run than the 12 months, and that's how they get you in. You see the first bill at $12.96, but the next three bills are $38.85. The 6 month is $29.94, and the next bill is $77.70.

The 12 month is $77.04 You save more with the 12 month than the others. The quarterly is $129.51, the 6 month is $107.64.

 

Nice how they trick you eh?

Yeah, I understand the caveats...my subscription ran out in late November (don't really miss it) and if I sign up, it will be for 3 months and cancel (see cancel anytime clause). Silly Sirius, tricks are for kids!

Here's a cut-and-paste from an email I just received...in the subject line, it says "Final Notice"...67% off of 3 months, 60% off of 6 months or 50% off of 12 months????????? The longer you commit for, the more you pay monthly....what kind of marketing is this?

OFFER DETAILS: (OFFER 1:) Activate a prepaid Quarterly Plan to "SIRIUS Everything" and get 67% off for 3 months ($4.32/mo versus $12.95/mo); (OFFER 2:) Activate a prepaid 6-Month Plan to "SIRIUS Everything" and get 60% off for 6 months ($4.99/mo versus $12.95/mo); or (OFFER 3:) Activate a prepaid Annual Savings Plan to "SIRIUS Everything" and get 50% off for 12 months ($6.42/mo versus $12.95/mo). Service will automatically renew and at our then-current standard subscription rates after your welcome-back promotional period ends, unless you cancel. Exclusive offer only available to addressee. ADDITIONAL DETAILS: Activation fee of $15 is waived for subscriptions that qualify for this promotion. Other taxes and fees will apply. Cannot be combined with any other offer. SIRIUS reserves the right to modify or terminate this offer at any time. Pricing and programming are subject to change. Subscriptions governed by the SIRIUS Terms & Conditions, available at sirius.com/serviceterms. Subscription Packages that include music channels will be charged a small U.S. Music Royalty Fee per paid month of your plan term. This offer and SIRIUS Radio U.S. Satellite service available only in the 48 contiguous United States, D.C. and Puerto Rico, to those at least 18 years of age. (Puerto Rico residents should consult SIRIUS Customer Care for the most current satellite reception information. SIRIUS|XM Internet Radio service is available in all areas of Puerto Rico.)

Unlike all other times, during my drive this morning, I was unable to turn on my rear defroster (definitely was not just the light indicator). My windshield defroster worked just fine so at the stop light, I turned the key to off and turned the engine back on (Microsoft fix). Rear defroster was functional again. Weird software bug? I hope this is not a sign of things to come.

2009 Turbo-Tax program will correctly compute your FFH Hybrid tax credit. I put 2/26/2009 as my purchase date (the date I committed/ordered) and 4/14/2009 as the date placed in service and up popped $3,400. That made me happy.

 

Now I wish I had ordered two.

Awesome...that was what I was asking about earlier...THANKS!

Yesterday I received, via snail mail, an offer for 6mos for 4.99/month. Sounds decent but I think I'll pass. Just FYI for those looking for options