Ford Fusion Rear Noise - metal scraping sound

[MikeSmith]

Just purchased a 2017 Ford Fusion Hybrid from carvana with about 29k miles.  There is a passenger side, rear high pitched metal scraping noise that I am not sure what it is.  Only audible to me on quiet streets driving under 50mph.  I posted the sound on Youtube, link below.  Any help would be great.  Thank you!

 

 

https://www.youtube....eature=youtu.be

[bangster]

Was that an audio recording with a static image? I only hear birds, kids, and monkeys while staring at a stationary vehicle.

[VonoreTn]

Maybe the rear parking brake needs adjusting?  

[MikeSmith]

Thanks for the reply.  Yes that was a static image.  I was driving about 25 mph on some back streets .  

[bbf2530]

1 hour ago, MikeSmith said:

Just purchased a 2017 Ford Fusion Hybrid from carvana with about 29k miles.  There is a passenger side, rear high pitched metal scraping noise that I am not sure what it is.  Only audible to me on quiet streets driving under 50mph.  I posted the sound on Youtube, link below.  Any help would be great.  Thank you!

 

 

https://www.youtube....eature=youtu.be

 

Hi Mike.  Could be several things.  Wheel bearing, brake issue etc., but no way to tell from that sound file.  You still have ~7,000 miles left on your Bumper to Bumper Warranty.  Make an appointment at your local Ford Dealership, bring it in and ask that a Service Advisor or Tech take a short ride with you so you can have them verify they hear it, and let them fix it.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

Edited July 18, 2018 by bbf2530

[MikeSmith]

Thanks. Took it to Sunrise Ford.  They said it is due to Rust on the brakes and rotor.  And they won't cover it because  it is rust related, normal wear and tear.   They also said they see some rust on the frame, not sure how bad it is.  I'm a bit frustrated right now. I don't feel I should be responsible for that repair cost only have the 9 days. 

[bbf2530]

18 minutes ago, MikeSmith said:

Thanks. Took it to Sunrise Ford.  They said it is due to Rust on the brakes and rotor.  And they won't cover it because  it is rust related, normal wear and tear.   They also said they see some rust on the frame, not sure how bad it is.  I'm a bit frustrated right now. I don't feel I should be responsible for that repair cost only have the 9 days. 

 

Hi Mike. The rotors are steel and will get a bit of surface rust, especially in rainy conditions or after a few days of the car not being driven. If it simply rust on the rotors it should stop after the first few brake applications. the pads will remove the rust after a few stops. Does the sound stop after the first few brake applications? If yes, stop worrying about it. If it does not go away after ~4-5 brake applications, then it is not simply surface rust on the rotors and should be looked at further by the Dealership.

 

Rust on the "frame" or underside metal parts of a car is generally the same type of situation.  The metal parts on the underside of cars are not rust proof.  They will develop surface rust. Unless it is an unusual amount and more than surface rust, it is nothing to worry about.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

Edited July 19, 2018 by bbf2530

[MikeSmith]

Thanks for the info. The sound does continue after braking a few times. I can't really hear the sound on the freeway, but on surface streets driving under 50mph I can certainly hear it continuously.  The sound is only in the rear although the Ford service man did say there is rust on both front and back brakes and rotors. Sunrise Ford refused to give me the full diagnostics report until I pay $145.  Currently trying to get Carvana to cover that. 

[MikeSmith]

images the ford service  man sent me

[bangster]

That is pretty bad, more than just rust. Was this car stored in a swamp? 1 year old? I have 30 year old vehicles that look better than that.

 

This is 10 straight days of rain, I expect the rotors to be cleaned up after stop 1 or 2:

 

This is 5 years of sitting (we don't get much rain, but enough), I think the first few stops would be sketchy, I wouldn't drive it like this:

 

[MikeSmith]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts Bangster.  I don't have much experience in this area so I don't know what is considered bad or ok rust levels, but you are certainly making me worry about my purchasing decision. 

[bbf2530]

Hi Mike.  I am now concerned that perhaps you were sold a car which was at least partially flood damaged or in a flood area. In addition, if I'm looking at the photos correctly, it seems that at least one or two of the brake rotors are not even being cleaned of surface rust when you apply the brakes.. Especially that last photo. that is more than normal surface rust.

 

One other thing. Why are you being charged for a "diagnostic report"? Your 2017 car is still under warranty, correct? 3 years/36,000 miles Bumper to Bumper.

 

Get back to us with that information.

Edited July 19, 2018 by bbf2530

[MikeSmith]

The dealership told me that they don't cover rust issues. 

[MikeSmith]

I appreciate everyone's input. So as of now it looks like after going back and forth with Carvana and The Ford dealership and Carvana's 100 days warranty partner Silver Rock.   Silver Rock will cover the replacement of both front and back brakes and rotors. Should this ease my worries, or based upon the rust damage you see can I expect more problems to occur sooner than your average Fusion?

[bbf2530]

16 hours ago, MikeSmith said:

I appreciate everyone's input. So as of now it looks like after going back and forth with Carvana and The Ford dealership and Carvana's 100 days warranty partner Silver Rock.   Silver Rock will cover the replacement of both front and back brakes and rotors. Should this ease my worries, or based upon the rust damage you see can I expect more problems to occur sooner than your average Fusion?

 

Hi Mike.  That is an unusual amount of rust accumulation for a one model year old car. Just curious, how many miles are on it?

 

And while it is not possible make a definitive judgement by those close up photos, my opinion is that car seems to have been submerged at least up to and over the brake hardware. Where was the car registered before you purchased it? How many owners etc?

 

Additionally, it is a Hybrid and therefore even more electrically and electronically intensive than a normal, non-Hybrid car. If the car was flood damaged, even minimally, you could be looking at major problems and repair bills later. And if it shows signs of flood damage, Ford will not cover it under warranty.

 

We can't definitively be sure of anything and certainly do not know your financial and car situation. However, only going by what we know so far, I would be reluctant to keep that car.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

 

EDIT - And while the Dealer is correct that they would not cover rust like that under warranty, the car is still under warranty and there is no reason for them to charge you a fee for a "diagnostic report". You may want to think about using another dealership for your service.

Additionally, being a rental in its previous life, it actually could have spent time anywhere in the US or Canada.  Again, I would be very leery of that vehicle's possible history.

Edited July 20, 2018 by bbf2530

[MikeSmith]

28,450 miles -  registered in Illinois - It was a rental car - price I paid before taxes was $15,800. Carfax said no reported flood damage, no salvage, no accidents. 

[bbf2530]

2 minutes ago, MikeSmith said:

28,450 miles -  registered in Illinois - It was a rental car - price I paid before taxes was $15,800. Carfax said no reported flood damage, no salvage, no accidents. 

 

Hi Mike. So it spent at least one winter (maybe two) in a cold, probably salted roads environment.  In my opinion, those photos still show an abnormally high amount of rust and corrosion, even for a northern location. And all that Carfax report means is nothing was reported. It still could have damage or incidents which were not reported.  It does happen.

 

And according to your information, you are located on the Pacific coast. That leads me to wonder why that car was brought from Illinois to the Pacific coast. Perhaps for no particularity bad reason...or perhaps to help hide it's past location and damages.  Again, impossible to tell, but those photos show far more than normal rust, even for two Illinois winters.That is my educated opinion.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

[MikeSmith]

I bought it from Carvana.com  - an online car dealer. They can ship cars from all over the country I believe. 

[bangster]

If you live in a place where cars do not generally suffer from rust, then replacing those rotors and treating the other under body rust should be fine. For the under body rust to be covered, it needs to be perforated, and sounds more like it is surface rust.

 

I haven't fully checked out my car that was a Colorado car, I lived in the northwest corner of Colorado and some cars did rust out, depended on well you kept them hosed off underneath. This one was from the southeast, and should be okay, but the more I look at my rotors the more I wonder what else I will find.

 

This was a 2010 in the junk yard, and more of what I am used to. I might spend the 60 bucks to get all rotors and calipers, I had planned on going up in size with MS6 brakes, but that might take awhile. Desert Southwest!

[bbf2530]

3 hours ago, MikeSmith said:

I bought it from Carvana.com  - an online car dealer. They can ship cars from all over the country I believe. 

 

Hi Mike.  Yes I know and understand that Carvana, like any car Dealer or selling service, can ship cars from all over the country.  But that costs money and eats into profits. It is more profitable to sell a car where it already is than to ship it all over the country. So I still would be wary of a car shipped so far from it's home.

 

The rust and corrosion shown in those photos is abnormal. To me it seems as though it was in water up past the mid wheel level. As far as the rotors - After a few stops, the swept area (gripped by the pads) should be rust free. Those rotors and other parts shown show unusual rust and corrosion.

 

If you have your heart set on the car, take it to an independent mechanic and ask their opinion. I would not decide what to do by what all of us say here. We have not seen the car first hand. As far as perforated or not, that is the warranty requirement for body panels, not underbody rust. Underbody parts do not rust or corrosion perforate in three years (or five, which is the rust/corrosion warranty period for body panels) and are generally not covered for surface rust unless it affects driveability and/or safety.

 

Personally, I would not keep that car, if you still have a choice. But as I stated above, if your heart is set on keeping it, get a recommendation for a good independent mechanic, take it there for an inspection, tell them about your concerns, have them inspect it and go from there.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

Edited July 20, 2018 by bbf2530

[twiggy144]

My daughter left her car parked outside last winter one month without rolling. All four rotors are now as bad - maybe worse - than the ones pictured above. I replaced all 4 rotors and pads 12 months ago. Yet, in our climate (Montreal) if you dont drive the car frequently, rust will appear fast. Wait too long, and rust will be beyond repair ( meaning applying the brakes will not suffice to scrape off  the light layer of surface rust). Remedy: machine the rotors, or replace with new rotors.

 

This being said, used cars often stay idle on used car lots for weeks, or months. This will be more than enough time for the rotors to rust beyond repair.

 

 

 

Edited July 20, 2018 by twiggy144
addition

[lolder]

There were up to a million cars flooded in the past year or two. I would not buy a used car today unless I positively knew where it had been. The ability of used car cheats to launder away the damages is beyond most buyers ability to check. Widespread rust on other than brake discs is not normal.

[sirtanon]

My big concern here is this picture, showing the caliper:

 

 

Is that a crack I see??

 

As others have said, get new rotors, new pads, and at least one new caliper, if not both.  The rotors and pads can be had for pretty cheap - I just did my rears and my total cost in parts was less than $50, including new rotors and pads.   Granted, mine is a 2010, and yours is a 2017, but that shouldn't make that much difference in all honesty.  The biggest cost for you will be the calipers.

 

Also, if I was in your shoes, I'd do the work, then send Carvana the bill for the parts, letting them know that they clearly sold you a car with major safety issues and the least they could do was make good on them.

[drolds1]

If possible, I'd return this car.  That's a crack in the caliper.  How does a 2017 car with 29K have a cracked caliper?  I have a 22-year-old car and the calipers don't have the general appearance of the one in the picture.  I'm no expert, but it looks like this car was submerged in salt water up to the underbody. 

 

I'd take bbf2530's advice and get the car inspected by an independent shop.  Maybe your insurance co. can steer you to a specialist in detecting flood damage.  Then take it from there.

 

It's serious enough with a conventional car.  Even more so with a hybrid. 

[MikeSmith]

I appreciate all of the feed back. I put too much trust into Carvana's marketing of selling quality vehicles that pass a rigorous inspection. I wish I would have paid someone to inspect the car appropriately within the 7 days window no questions asked return policy. Today is my 10th day owning the car. I honestly thought the rear wheel sound would be a simple fix that would be covered no problem under the warranty they provide. Now I have a dealership holding my car that can't get a reply back from Carvana's warranty partner Silver Rock.  I've expressed my concerns with Carvana and I'm waiting to hear back from a more informed employee.