ajberezin Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 I know this topic is probably been beaten to death but I haven't found a definitive answer. I know the advertised HP and torque ratings are for 93 octane gas. Right now I am not worried about fuel economy, price etc for this discussion. I have a 2014 SE 2.0 Ecoboost Fusion. Is 93 octane for the 2.0 Ecoboost engine give it better performance than 87? I want to know real life performance. If you think it makes the car run better. Thanks for your input!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyross Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Around here, Premimum is now around $0.50-$0.70 more than Regular. To be honest, unless you are drag racing, you probably wouldn't notice much difference. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drolds1 Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 The definitive answer is right on the Ford Fusion website. 240 @ 5,500 (premium fuel) 231@5,500 (regular fuel) There you have it, right from the horse's mouth. Using premium fuel in the 2.0 EB gives you 9 more hp and no gain in torque. You'll have to make the decision if it's worth it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajberezin Posted November 16, 2014 Author Share Posted November 16, 2014 Actually the torque shown on the site is with 93 octane. They don't show the torque with 87. I know the specs but was wondering real world. I wanted to know from drivers that used 93 if they feel a difference. I notice a little better pickup and smother accelration. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGee Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Same here with 93 octane better acceleration & smoother shifts, plus marginal mileage improvement, but not enough to justify the 20cents per Litre price difference. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 Since both HP figures are at 5500 rpm, the torque has to be lower on 87. I'd guess about 10 lb/ft (too lazy to do the math). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 Also do not forget that you will usually get a flatter torque curve on premium fuel. I will not use anything else in mine as it makes a huge difference. That is likely why I feel the difference even if the hp difference is only 9. I actually find myself unable to floor the gas below 35 mph as it will just break the tyres loose. I also noticed better fuel economy on premium. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph Day Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 I'm going to dito everything above. I've noticed a substantial increase in acceleration and smoother shifting. After the first couple of tanks of gas, I've only used premium. The car just seems to drive nicer, smoother. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Woellner Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 I've tried both in my 2.0T and noticed a slight difference but not enough to pay the extra $. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Did you try using premium fuel for an extended period of time? The ECM often takes time to re-calibrate itself to fully take advantage of the extra octane. You will also probably notice a small increase in fuel economy which would also help offset the additional cost of premium. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajberezin Posted November 27, 2014 Author Share Posted November 27, 2014 I have been using it for a couple of weeks and I find the engine runs smoother, acceleration is better, and idle is quieter. I haven't looked ant the numbers for fuel milage because I still only have over 2000 miles on the car. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junehhan Posted November 27, 2014 Share Posted November 27, 2014 It will probably be a while before you can get accurate fuel economy measurements then. Some Ecoboosts are better than others as some take much longer to break in. My current Fusion got very good fuel economy almost right away at about 2000 miles, but I remember my 3.5 Ecoboost didn't start to really wake up with better performance and fuel economy till around 10000 miles. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 So far I've only seen opinions based on ones' "butt dyno" which is susceptible to the placebo effect. (correct me if I'm wrong, but aside from Ford's published spec, nobody here has any hard numbers from dyno pulls, etc. to support the benefits of 93 over regular) I'm not saying everyone who says their car runs better on premium is wrong. But I will say that a 3% increase in peak power is not "huge" by any stretch of the imagination, if you even see that in the real world. It's also important to keep in mind what the octane rating actually means - the fuel's resistance to preignition. It has absolutely nothing to do with the amount of energy present in the fuel or the quality of the fuel. I could go into a whole lot of detail that most people here probably won't read, but suffice it to say, it's reasonable to assume that using premium fuel in our 10.5:1 compression, turbocharged engines would result in better performance. However, I can tell you that in the ~8 hours of datalogs I've pulled from my car with my SCT Tuner and running 87 octane, I have never once seen the computer retard timing due to the knock sensor. I'm hoping that is fixed with the custom tune I'm having done... if it ever gets finished... it's apparently taking a really long time since SCT didn't have my strategy in their database yet. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 The computer in some Ford vehicles will advance the timing as much as possible given the available fuel resulting in a slight increase in power and fuel economy. Whether it's enough to notice is debatable, but it's definitely not enough to be cost effective. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 The computer in some Ford vehicles will advance the timing as much as possible given the available fuel resulting in a slight increase in power and fuel economy. Whether it's enough to notice is debatable, but it's definitely not enough to be cost effective. The fact that mine is never retarding timing because of the knock sensor tells me it's not advancing timing enough to take advantage of higher octane fuel. This is also one of the reasons a custom tune is so effective on these engines. A custom (performance) tune will advance timing more aggressively and only pull back when it detects preignition. Maybe the 2.0L engine's programming is different, but I doubt it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 It's possible the 1.6L doesn't do it but the 2.0 definitely does - Ford even advertises the 2 different power levels depending on fuel used. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 It's possible the 1.6L doesn't do it but the 2.0 definitely does - Ford even advertises the 2 different power levels depending on fuel used. I guess the only way to know for sure would be to look at a datalog. Speculation only gets ya so far. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 I guess the only way to know for sure would be to look at a datalog. Speculation only gets ya so far. Or get your information from a Ford employee, in addition to common sense that says the only way to get a hp gain from 93 octane is to advance the timing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waldo Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 I guess the only way to know for sure would be to look at a datalog. Speculation only gets ya so far. Datalogs are only useful if you know what you're looking for. I don't know much about them myself, but it wouldn't surprise me if the retard function and the active advance function are totally separate. Are you looking at the actual timing values, or are you just looking for the knock sensor signals? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indyZrider Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 I guess the only way to know for sure would be to look at a datalog. Speculation only gets ya so far. guess everything in the manual is speculation then.....maybe i should sue Ford for not stating the facts..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 (edited) Or get your information from a Ford employee, in addition to common sense that says the only way to get a hp gain from 93 octane is to advance the timing. What should happen and what does happen are sometimes different. There are other factors that determine how far advanced the computer will set the timing. If those factors don't allow the timing to be advanced to the point at which detonation would begin to happen it won't matter what a Ford employee says or what common sense tells you. Edited December 1, 2014 by jeff711981 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Datalogs are only useful if you know what you're looking for. I don't know much about them myself, but it wouldn't surprise me if the retard function and the active advance function are totally separate. Are you looking at the actual timing values, or are you just looking for the knock sensor signals? Both. I don't have them in front of me, but there are several timing related items logged, one of which is how many degrees timing is being retarded due to the output of the knock sensor. See here: http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/2011-2014-mustang-talk/416697-sct-datalog-knock-sensor-pid.html 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 guess everything in the manual is speculation then.....maybe i should sue Ford for not stating the facts..... I understand you're being facetious, but neither Ford nor any manufacturer will publish facts for each individual vehicle they produce under every possible operating condition. What they do do, is produce vehicles with a computer program generic enough that the engine will run properly under most operating conditions the vehicle will encounter throughout its life. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 So what is your point? That Ford is lying or that something else is preventing the timing from being advanced on 93 octane fuel? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff711981 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 So what is your point? That Ford is lying or that something else is preventing the timing from being advanced on 93 octane fuel? My point is that the gains by switching to 93 octane likely cannot be described as "huge" with the stock tune as it may not even be advancing timing to the point at which detonation would occur even with 87 octane. As I said before... I won't say any of you are wrong, just that the "butt dyno" is unscientific and any real change felt while driving would absolutely be measurable and visible in data logs, which is what I'd prefer to see before spending an extra 15% on fuel as opposed to the perception of people who "know" that they just put "high performance gas" in their car. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.