Takata air bag recall

[abrowne]

I have a 2010 fusion sport and have been really happy with it. I recently got the letter from Ford that says the passenger side airbag is being recalled but no parts are available. I have read that out of 100 airbags deployed that 10 of them did the shrapnel trick. So i got out the fusion owners manual and pulled underdash fuse 46 with is the 7.5 amp fuse powering the occupant sensor and the passenger airbag warning light. I now have an airbag light on which is fine with me if the airbags do not deploy. While NHSTA says dont disconnect because "airbags can save lives" it is my observation that race cars have seatbelts and no airbags. It will be interesting to see how long it takes to get the parts.

[akirby]

Race cars also have roll cages, helmets and five-way racing seatbelts.

Edited July 25, 2016 by akirby

[Waldo]

Where did you see that 10 out of 100 number? From what I've heard, it's more like 1 in a million.

 

If it were me, I'd put your fuse back in. The chances of the driver's airbag saving your life is likely far, far greater than the chances of the passenger airbag killing you or a passenger.

 

The 5-point harness and helmets that race cars/drivers use makes comparisons irrelevant. Plus they all now use the "Hans" device that prevents their heads from falling forward in a crash, which is one of the major things airbags are designed for.

[akirby]

I think the 10 out of 100 was something with the Honda airbags, not Ford.

[BlueOval2010]

Even if it is 10 out of 100, that's a 90 percent chance that it won't be bad. Pretty good odds.

[abrowne]

I got the 10 out of 100 from a study where the authors acquired 100 takata airbags out of junkyards and deployed all of them. Ten deployed shrapnel. While 10 percent doesn't sound that bad thats only if you are not one of the ten. While the point about 5 point seatbelts, hans devices and the other race equipment is perhaps valid I also do not travel in excess of 85 mph while most race vehicles do. It remains a fact that racecars do not have airbags.

It is also true that the principle safety device is the seatbelts and the airbag was originally designed for unbelted dingbats. There may be advantages to airbags plus seatbelts but I am willing to trust the seatbelts rather than a potential handgrenade on the passenger side. It seems silly to me to say to just sit in the back seat as a good idea (some manufacturers have said this) to avoid injury when we are talking steel shrapnel traveling at a high rate of speed. if the shrapnel is traveling fast enough to kill somebody in the front seat, and nobody is sitting in the front the person in the back is next in line. By removing the fuse and therefore knowing that your car can not kill your passenger until the parts are available to correctly fix the problem, seems to be a good trade off.

[komondor]

Here is the info I found from May 2015

 

• There is a danger from the air bags, but the odds are low. In crashes — and only in crashes — the Takata air bags can deploy with too much force, spewing bits of metal and plastic at the driver or passenger. Six have died worldwide and there have been about 100 injuries. But that number pales compared to the 33.8 million vehicles now included in the recall. Also, the risk is higher in areas with high humidity.

 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/05/20/takata-air-bags/27671483/

[abrowne]

Hey komondor,

So we just start noticing the problem in areas of high humidity after so many years and the odds it will happen to you are going to stay the same? The odds of shrapnel happening are going to get a whole lot worse as the ammonium nitrate ages. Since I am so lucky at winning the lottery my luck would be that i would see shrapnel in a front end collision. Texans have a special relationship with ammonium nitrate (see West and Texas City) and I for one don't trust ammonium nitrate any further that i could throw Tim McVea. The point remains that airbags are Supplemental Restraint Systems and the primary systems remains seatbelts. I will trust my seatbelts and number 46 fuse will stay in the glovebox, thank you very much.

[Monochrome11]

I tend to agree with you abrowne. There is one thing that I am concerned about with disabling the airbags though, liability. Would an insurance company find a way to get out of paying for injuries if the airbags where intentionally disabled. In the event of a death would life insurance be subject to being voided. Could a passengers family win a lawsuit because you disabled the airbags? I think this is a tough decision and could be more complex than thinking you are making it safer in your vehicle.

[abrowne]

Hey monochrome11

Liability is an issue. Shops will not disable because of this. That is why I did it myself. If i leave the fuse in and the airbag kills my wife, will Takata reimburse the insurance company for the death benefit or will the insurance company say it is Takata's fault? With the fuse out at least the passenger avoided a 1 in 10 chance of shrapnel. I understand that airbags were originally designed to protect the unbelted. What additional benefits do you get when and if the airbag deploys when you are belted? I have not seen sufficient scientific research that justifies a benefit that out ways a 1 in 10 chance of shrapnel.

How is Toyota justifying disabling airbags? I can make a better case for disabling the airbag, than having a undefined benefit and a one in ten chance of shrapnel by leaving it in. The point is that I or my passenger will be alive to have that discussion. Thank you for your input.

[Waldo]

The point is that the 1 in 10 is not the real number. If it was really 1 in 10, any car with a Takata airbag would be instantly grounded and not allowed on the road. There would also be way, way, way more reported deaths than there are.

 

While airbags were initially designed for unbelted occupants, the designs have evolved significantly. Today it's really more of a restraint system. The seatbelt and airbag are designed to work together as a system. The seatbelts have more "give" in them than they would without the airbag. That allows for slower deceleration of your body, but also allows you to travel closer to the steering wheel/dash. That's where the airbag comes in, to stop you from hitting anything and to further slow the deceleration as well as to control the motion of your head. A seatbelt won't prevent your neck from snapping forward.

 

Also keep in mind that by pulling the fuse you're also disabling the side airbags.

 

Fortunately I don't have to make the choice, but if I did, I'd be keeping the airbags active.

[abrowne]

What I read was 100 takata airbags from junkyards that were from recalled vehicles and they were deployed and 10 deployed shrapnel. Your two points of "if it was really 1 in 10 ......" and "way more reported deaths." are both assumptions that I am not comfortable with. Since this has just come to light the numbers are probably going to increase by several factors as time goes on. While airbags have evolved to provide more "protection" it remains that they are a supplement to seatbelts and since I am not interested in playing Takata roulette i will leave the fuse in the glovebox and trust my seatbelt. Toyota is disabling airbags so my reasoning is at least reasonable.

[akirby]

Just do whatever you want and stop arguing about it.

[abrowne]

Hey, I already did it and nobody has come up with a good enough reason for me to change my mind.

Thanks for the input.

[akirby]

The reasons were all good, you just didn't agree with them. Which is fine.

[komondor]

blow the fuse and put it back at least

[abrowne]

Hey Komondor,

Then I would have to buy a fuse when the passenger side airbag gets replaced!

[komondor]

yes but you don't have the liability of pulling the fuse in case of an accident

[abrowne]

Okay after two years of having fuse 46 in the glovebox, I get a letter from Ford that they will let me use a rent car on their dime while they figure out who to buy a new passenger side airbag from.  Enough is enough, I swapped of the 2010 fusion sport  with 94000 miles on it for a brand new 2018 fusion sport with the 2.7 eco boost.    Faster and approximately the same fuel mileage.  And after checking all the internet sites I found a pearl white one for the same price I paid for the 2010.  Since Takata is dead as a doornail the problem should be solved.