My instructions on restoring the hybrid EV function on the Ford Fusion Hybrid approaching the 8/9+ years mark.

[dogo88]

36 minutes ago, akirby said:

 

It makes perfect sense to anyone who has done software development and/or worked in large corporations.   And planned obsolescence is a nice theory but doesn't hold water when you have other Ford vehicles going 200K-300K miles with no issues.

 

Don't disagree with you but these are hybrids which Ford doesn't have decades of experience with. The  2005 Escape hybrid was their first foray into hybrid vehicles. Was thinking of getting one but price wise for us didn't pan out. And true that other Ford vehicles go 200k-300k miles, but Ford doesn't warranty them or do and TSBs other than safety recalls that I am aware of. So the expectation of Ford supporting a 10 year old vehicle hasn't been done before. 

[rexberglund]

Thanks Allen but I took my vehicle to my neighborhood shop and they said they wouldn't do it due to liability concerns.

 

Just got my 2010 Fusion Hybrid back from Ford yesterday after they applied TSB 20-2142, car is now back to normal.

[PaulGo]

7 minutes ago, rexberglund said:

Thanks Allen but I took my vehicle to my neighborhood shop and they said they wouldn't do it due to liability concerns.

 

Just got my 2010 Fusion Hybrid back from Ford yesterday after they applied TSB 20-2142, car is now back to normal.

Did they tell you what TSB 20-2142 did to fix the problem?   Also, did they charge you for doing the TSB?

Edited May 16, 2020 by PaulGo

[rexberglund]

No details, but the TSB says to reprogram "software in the battery energy control module (BECM) and the powertrain control module (PCM)." That's more extensive than Allen's proven battery age fix.

 

I'd be interested in all the details too.

 

They would've charged a half hour labor but I had a warning for the AdvanceTrack system fixed by replacing the lower control rods so they didn't charge for the TSB reprogramming. 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by rexberglund
Add cost info.

[POB in VA]

Has anyone who's done the allen 84 fix ("Allen's Fix") gone to Ford to have the TSB ("Ford Fix") service done?  I can think of a couple potential issues (not an exhaustive collection, but just a couple of thoughts).

 

Situation 1.  Try to "reverse" the Allen's Fix, resetting the battery age to real time).

a.  Wonder if Ford service tech can see that this has been done? 

•  Would he/she care?  That is, "rat the customer out" and refuse to do anything more?
• Could he/she even see that it was done?  Looking over the TSB on page 12 of this thread there's nothing that specifies any action "if customer has made any modifications" (or such wording).
  • Having heard from many customers (well, maybe; most of us went to our dealer, some of us, such as me, called and wrote to Ford corporate, so the Ford people who worked on this fix may well have known about Allen's Fix, and has Ford put some sort of a software detection algorithm into their own fix that somehow searches for an "outside" modification that would then trigger a "stop action" warning on the service tech's computer screen? 
    • Would they have cared enough (or been funded enough in the fix effort - that may be the rate limiting step - Ford probably only authorized a certain amount of money to be expended towards a fix for a relatively small number of 10 year old cars, and to do more than just get a fix out might have gone over budget) to have taken extra time to do this even?  Anything can be done w/enough time and $$, but it's a business decision as to how much of either are budgeted.
    • Don't know if that can even be done but programmers and programs are obviously pretty sophisticated these days.
• And then there's the concerns that others have brought up.  What exactly is the Ford Fix going to "do" (besides restore one's car to normal function as rexberglund  indicated that it does do (yay!)?
  • Will it trigger something else literally down the road - e.g. another year or so tell you that you need to buy a new battery or some other such big expense?  Not a conspiracy theory - just honest thought about what the potential consequences are.  And, of course, giving due to the alternative - none of us really know if Allen's Fix won't have undue consequences in the future, either.  That question has been brought up and we don't think it will (well, those who know far more about it than I do have opined that it probably won't, so I'm going with them, since I did it!).  All of us who did it, however, made that decision already because we were desperate to get a normally functioning vehicle again and had no idea that Ford would ever do anything about it.

Situation 2.  Allen's Fix applied, and LEFT INTACT (that is, one just takes one's car with Allen's Fix in place - the battery age shows substantially lower than the known age of the vehicle).

• In this situation, presumably the service tech can and will presumably see the alteration in the programming that we all did.  Basically, the age of the battery as specified in the programming will be less than the age of the car, by whatever increment/interval the individual owner applying Allen's Fix chose to set it at.
  • On one hand, that could be explained if the owner had truly bought a new battery (which of course didn't have to be done at the current service location doing the TSB Ford Fix, so they can't assume that they have a service record) BUT I'm just going to take a guess that replacing the battery would lead to a more extensive set of electronic changes that can otherwise be detected by the service tech when reviewing the program, or checking the battery's health (that doesn't seem to be part of the TSB, but I don't have enough knowledge to know one way or another).
  • Would changing the HVB have fixed the driveability/mileage issues we've all complained of, such that the Ford Fix isn't even needed?  In other words, the service tech knows something's fishy because a new HVB wouldn't have this issue in the first place?  From some other posts that I think I recall, it didn't, but I didn't go back and look through all 13 pages of this thread.
  • Once again, would the service tech even care?  Or would he/she simply apply the Ford Fix and move on with life to the next customer's car.
• Then of course we loop back to the question of what the Ford Fix will do in the future, if anything else.

Ah, so many questions!  Having applied Allen's Fix (again, thank you so much; I've got my car back in terms of its greatly improved mileage and its functionality/how it drives!!) and committed to the unknowns that presents much of me wants to just keep moving on and forget it, but part of me wonders if going with "Big Brother's" (Ford) fix wouldn't be the better way to go (basically, trusting authority; SURELY Ford would do the right thing by its customers, right?).

 

I'm not trying to fix anything with this post, or advocate one or the other approach, because I of course have no idea what the right thing is, I don't think any of us do, but just wanted to bring up some questions/thoughts.

 

If anyone who's applied Allen's Fix DOES go to the shop for the Ford Fix, PLEASE let us know!!  Thanks!!

[PaulGo]

Judging by the they way the technicians at my dealership attempted to "fix" one of my two 2010 Mercury Milan vehicles I just think they will hook the car up to the computer and apply the Ford TSB.   They really showed no interest in going beyond what was instructed for them to do and they kept on coming back and saying the car was fixed when it was not.  I brought one of cars back to the dealership several times and they had it in the shop for almost two weeks! 

[POB in VA]

Hi PaulGo,

 

Thanks very much for your thoughts.  I hope that you've had your cars fixed finally!

 

I want to make sure I understand what you were experiencing.  Sorry to hear that they kept one of your cars for 2 weeks!

 

Did they "apply" the Ford Fix and it took them two weeks to do it and still didn't fix it? (Yikes, if that's the case)

 

Or were your experiences before the TSB (I had my car in 4 times, once for 4 days, they were clueless) so they were running around in the dark without any idea of what was going on?

 

Were your cars fixed with the TSB?

 

Did you do Allen's Fix?

 

I'm certainly suspicious that the service techs will do as you suggested - just do the fix and move on.  What's it to them, really, their basic job is to try to repair something that isn't working, but if FoMoCo is telling them (or the computer fix they put in place tells them), then they may be forced to not apply the TSB by powers above them (see below - they sure did it once, already, to me).

 

Your comments definitely bring up another issue.  What if Allen's Fix is in place and the car is again driving normally?  My dealership is definitely a bunch of "doubting Thomases."  3 of the 4 times I took it in, EVEN WHEN IT WAS CLEARLY MALFUNCTIONING (!!!) they said "normal function" (once despite 4 days w/it) and didn't even TRY to work on it.  The fourth time was after the 10/2019 notice that Ford sent out that there is a problem, but dealers shouldn't touch the cars.  They acknowledged that it wasn't driving right then, but said they couldn't touch it (this is the "higher powers" that I'm questioning above saying "don't do something").  I then applied Allen's Fix, and later the TSB with Ford Fix came out. 

 

So if my "team" drove my car (if I went in for the TSB) I'm wondering also if they'd just say "it ain't broke, so we ain't gonna fix it" (e.g. apply the TSB)!  It drives fine now; they couldn't tell before that it wasn't!  Or, will they just say "ok, he's got a car that's in the affected range, we're just going to do the work and charge the money."

 

I'm really wondering if anyone has had the time yet since the TSB was released to have direct experiences with the fix, having done Allen's Fix and then either leaving it (the fix) intact and doing the TSB work or resetting Allen's Fix back to "normal" (correct battery age) and THEN doing the TSB (Ford Fix).

[PaulGo]

All my visits to my Ford dealership were last year before I applied Allen"s fix.   I applied Allen's fix about October of 2019.  

[Joeg2524642]

Have you tried paying for the extended license and use the as built configuration to correct the errors in the battery setup

 

[Campenella]

I called the dealer where I purchased my car.  Left a message about TSB-20-2142 and if they would perform the service and the charge.  No return call.....

[rexberglund]

Yeah, same here. Called 3 dealers before I found 1 who said he'd "talk to his hybrid guy." When I showed up they said they couldn't find the TSB and asked for it again. But in the end, seems to be working.

[dpete15312]

I have applied the  fix from Allen and he assisted me in doing so. He is an amazing person. I must report that my 2010 Fusion Hybrid continues to perform very well 3 months post fix.  No halting or stutter starts. Stays in EV up to the low 40 mph range. My combined mph stays around 39 mph as I concentrate on how to both properly brake to regenerate the hybrid battery as well as a slow deliberate responsible acceleration from stops. Say what you will both  pro and con concerning the fix. It has worked for me. I have 95,000 miles on my hybrid and purchased it at a bargain from someone who had settled for a vehicle that mostly ran on the gas engine which defeated the purpose of even having a hybrid.. The prior owner showed no interest in applying the fix. Will the fix hold for the long term? Who knows?. I think it will and am currently enjoying both the economy and performance of my vehicle. There you are. 

 

On 4/29/2020 at 11:53 PM, lolder said:

I think allen84's fix will not harm the battery. The tests of the HVB show little capacity loss at 160k miles. The only loss would be if a cell shorts but there are 207 of them so the percentage loss would be small. The car quits if a cell opens but I have not heard of even one of these. I believe there was a comment somewhere from within Ford a while back that the management of these NiMH batteries was going to make them last almost indefinitely. The 2nd most important aspect of Allen's fix is that the HVB resumes periodic re-conditioning.

You are correct. Allen84's "fix" worked well for me and he even helped me remotely to get the fix done. He is a great person. The  Fusion Hybrid is getting 39 mpg now combined. Around town at more  than 40 mpg with regenerative braking  now working well this vehicle is working as it should at this time. Of course you have to know how to drive this hybrid by braking to regenerate as much as possible and moving forward from stops with an easy accelerator (assuming the guy behind you does not get antsy) to stay in EV as much as possible. This car is fun to drive now especially as I continue to pass by my local gas station again and again without stopping.

[asicking]

1 hour ago, dpete15312 said:

I have applied the  fix from Allen and he assisted me in doing so. He is an amazing person. I must report that my 2010 Fusion Hybrid continues to perform very well 3 months post fix.  No halting or stutter starts. Stays in EV up to the low 40 mph range. My combined mph stays around 39 mph as I concentrate on how to both properly brake to regenerate the hybrid battery as well as a slow deliberate responsible acceleration from stops. Say what you will both  pro and con concerning the fix. It has worked for me. I have 95,000 miles on my hybrid and purchased it at a bargain from someone who had settled for a vehicle that mostly ran on the gas engine which defeated the purpose of even having a hybrid.. The prior owner showed no interest in applying the fix. Will the fix hold for the long term? Who knows?. I think it will and am currently enjoying both the economy and performance of my vehicle. There you are. 

 

You are correct. Allen84's "fix" worked well for me and he even helped me remotely to get the fix done. He is a great person. The  Fusion Hybrid is getting 39 mpg now combined. Around town at more  than 40 mpg with regenerative braking  now working well this vehicle is working as it should at this time. Of course you have to know how to drive this hybrid by braking to regenerate as much as possible and moving forward from stops with an easy accelerator (assuming the guy behind you does not get antsy) to stay in EV as much as possible. This car is fun to drive now especially as I continue to pass by my local gas station again and again without stopping.

I too am enjoying the results of this "fix".  After 9 months and almost 40K miles I'm getting consistent mpg in the low 40s.  And the car had over 300K when the fix was applied.  I'm not a car nut, but getting 40+ mpg on a nearly 10 year old car with 350K miles seems pretty remarkable.

[lolder]

This fix should last until the battery age counter gets up to 9 years again. Keep the info in the car so you can do it again if we live that long.

The cars will need other maintenance; O2 sensors, throttle body cleaning/replacement, electric vacuum pump and all the other old car things.

[jfleury86]

I am having a lot of problems getting this accomplished. I followed step by step...even ordered the same device off Amazon. And I keep running in to problems. First it needed a part number that you never mentioned anywhere so that took forever. I finally got past that and got connected but now it's saying these errors in the image. So I proceeded to try the BECM part and I can't get to the next step because this other error that says "service procedure has been interrupted". And it's just at 1%. 

[dpete15312]

Just a suggestion. I had a similar problem as I was tech challenged. I e-mailed Allen personally and he assisted me online. I do not know if he would do this for others or not but I gave him a donation in a reasonable amount by cashiers check to do so. I reasoned that either I donate / gift him  him or I pay Ford so I pai sent my donation to Allen. Again, you may want to contact him directly and see if he can give you some direct help. I highly recommend you at least contact him and ask.

[Spirit10]

I initially had a problem a little bit like yours that I thought was related to getting a good physical connection.  Service procedure interrupted any where from 1% to 15%.  I replugged the connections several times, wiggled the connections, tried old style TV tuner contact cleaner, straightened the cable bends, rebooting the laptop, etc.  Finally I got 100% and was able to read several items consistently and was able to unplug and replug a couple of times consistently and get good readings.  Then I quickly reset the battery age, heard the "clunk" from the trunk (that may be a high voltage contactor re-engaging the hybrid battery), and all was well.  So it might be you are getting a bad connection to the car causing the digital interface signals to be interrupted.  Try replugging several times to clean off any dust/etc that may be on the connections????

 

FWIW

(Another different Al)

[lolder]

It's unlikely the OBDII ports have ever been used much in these cars so cleaning the contacts first is a good idea. 

[Campenella]

I was finally able to get a hold of my local Ford Dealer.  They "appreciated me sending them the info on the TSB".  Funny it took me chatting online with someone other than the service department to get them to call me.  I had left a message a couple of weeks earlier, which they returned my call - after I had set the appointment the previous day!!!  Due to my computer situation at home the fix cost less that doing it myself - $99.  Got the car back last Friday;  works like a charm!!  No more hesitation, back to getting 40+ MPG around town.  232,000+ miles on my car, think I will keep it a bit longer.   Thanks for all the info on this part of the forum!!

[dpete15312]

For everyone's information, my 2010 Ford Fusion  continues to work flawlessly following "the fix" thanks to Allen. Mine now has 96,000 miles on it and I continue to get between 37 and 39 MPG combined with over 40mpg around the city. I am conscientious about both braking to regenerate the hybrid battery and to accelerate slower than normal to enable when possible to keep in EV mode up to and sometimes exceeding 40 mph depending upon terrain (and the patience of the guy behind me in the jacked up Ford F150 blinking his lights on and off)..  I have simply found that I have to drive this care differently than a normal car if I want to realize the efficiencies of a hybrid. Best to all.

[xns916]

My mileage has taken a dump, when first applied the fix I was getting about 38 mpg it's has gotten down to 33mpg, no driving patterns have changed 

[asicking]

Yikes!  Sounds like your car either has something else wrong With it or the “fix” wasn’t actually completed. My 300K+ miles 2010 went from mid-30s to low 40s immediately when I completed the change last August. 

[xns916]

1 minute ago, asicking said:

Yikes!  Sounds like your car either has something else wrong With it or the “fix” wasn’t actually completed. My 300K+ miles 2010 went from mid-30s to low 40s immediately when I completed the change last August. 

I the fix went smoothly, and nothing else is wrong with the car so idk.. it was getting upper 38 to 40

[asicking]

2 hours ago, xns916 said:

My mileage has taken a dump, when first applied the fix I was getting about 38 mpg it's has gotten down to 33mpg, no driving patterns have changed 

Yikes!  Sounds like your car either has something else wrong with it or the “fix” wasn’t actually completed. My 300K+ miles 2010 went from mid-30s to low 40s immediately when I completed the change last August. 

[Adee]

How are you "tracking" the MPG? I applied the fix, am seeing 2-3 bars of power, but am on 27.2 MPG. Am I looking in the right place?