What's the tire life on a Hybrid?

[Ponyguy]

Gentlemen (and the potential Lady)...

I bought a 2019 CPO Fusion Titanium Energie a couple of weeks ago, with ~9300 miles on the Odo.

This car has OEM Michelin Energy tires, P225-50 R17. (Curiously, the Titanium Energie model has 17" wheels, while the other Titanium models have 18".)

Thus far (350 miles or so) I'm ecstatic over the fuel mileage, and reasonably happy with the tires, and the car in general; that said, the ride comfort isn't quite the same as the Mercury Grand Marquis which I traded in for the Fusion... the Mercury had 16 inch wheels with softer 60 series tires.

Given the leisurely acceleration of the Hybrid powertrain, I expect the tires to last a long and happy life, probably needing replacement due to age rather than tread wear-out...

All that blabber aside, what sort of tire life do you Hybrid owners experience? Are there any unusual tire experiences owing to the Hybrid powertrain?

Thanks for your input!

[bangster]

My 2017 Escape has the same tires OEM, but in a slightly different size of 235/55/17. At 56,000 miles, they have 4/32 left. I think they have less than 10k miles left in them.

 

Decent tire, I could see replacing them with the same tire. They are a bit too greasy in the cold for me, if it is 30-40 degrees they lack bite and my NHRA style launches from stop lights turn into me chasing the cars front end a bit. They are okay in the rain (they are okay all around). Wife doesn't care, and it is her vehicle.

 

Hybrids tend to get lower rolling resistance tires but the same tires are used across the lineup. I think that all 17 inch rimmed cars get the Michelin Energy Saver A/S tires, the Energi (PHEV) gets narrower ones as 225 while all others get 235 width (including the HEV).

[bbf2530]

14 hours ago, Ponyguy said:

Gentlemen (and the potential Lady)...

I bought a 2019 CPO Fusion Titanium Energie a couple of weeks ago, with ~9300 miles on the Odo.

This car has OEM Michelin Energy tires, P225-50 R17. (Curiously, the Titanium Energie model has 17" wheels, while the other Titanium models have 18".)

Thus far (350 miles or so) I'm ecstatic over the fuel mileage, and reasonably happy with the tires, and the car in general; that said, the ride comfort isn't quite the same as the Mercury Grand Marquis which I traded in for the Fusion... the Mercury had 16 inch wheels with softer 60 series tires.

Given the leisurely acceleration of the Hybrid powertrain, I expect the tires to last a long and happy life, probably needing replacement due to age rather than tread wear-out...

All that blabber aside, what sort of tire life do you Hybrid owners experience? Are there any unusual tire experiences owing to the Hybrid powertrain?

Thanks for your input!

 

Hi Ponyguy. Like MPG's, tire life is a very individual experience that does not usually transfer well to others. However, here is my experience with the original/factory, 225/50-17, "Michelin Energy MXV4 S8" factory tires on my 2007 MKZ: I got ~54,000 miles out of them. They could have given me a few thousand more miles, but winter was approaching, so I decided to get new tires before the snows arrived. I do not drive hard. Maybe accelerate a little "spirited" once in a while, but do not corner hard. Replaced them with the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3 and got another ~54,000 out of them. Just recently replaced them with the updated Pilot Sport A/S 3+.

 

The factory 245/40-19 Michelin Primacy MXM4's on my 2018 MKZ currently have 7,500 miles.

 

Your Fusion being a Hybrid will not affect tire life, other than the possibility of it maybe being driven a little less aggressively than the average car, since it can be assumed a Hybrid owner wants better fuel mileage.

 

There is no reason you can not get 50,000+ miles out of the factory tires on your Fusion, if you keep your car properly aligned, and keep the tires properly inflated, rotated etc.

 

Good luck.

Edited February 10, 2020 by bbf2530

[Ponyguy]

Thanks, Mr. Bangster, and you, too, Mr. bbf2530!

 

I was just being curious, since I noticed the Energie was given a different tire & wheel combination from the other Titaniums, and different even from other Hybrids. I think I also read that the Energie model even has different brakes from other models.

 

The referenced ~50,000 mile tire life is pretty much what I've experienced in the other FoMoCo cars I'm used to owning; the 50k tire wear-out pretty much coincides with the tires drying out from exposure to the weather, anyway.

 

Edited February 10, 2020 by Ponyguy

[Waldo]

There's a lot more to tires than just the name on the sidewall.  Every tire on every Ford is very carefully selected and tuned to meet the exact character for the exact vehicle it is used on.  Saying the same tires are on the Escape and non-Hybrid is not really true, even though they might be the same model name.  Ford will tweak the tread compounds, the internal construction and many other factors to optimize the tire for it's intended use.

 

The 17in tires are used on the Energi because they have better rolling resistance than the 18in tires.  This becomes a factor in the advertise-able fuel economy.  The HEVs are heavier than the non-hybrid Fusions, so there will be more load going through the tires and thus slightly more wear.  The Energi is the heaviest of all, that's why it has slightly different brakes.  Also did you notice there is no spare tire?

 

I'm just about to hit 50K miles in my 2014 Hybrid and it's time for new tires, so for me the 50K estimate is about right.  And to correct Bangster, my HEV has the 225 tires, not the 235.

[bangster]

A Michelin Energy X Saver A/S is a Michelin Energy X Saver A/S is a Michelin Energy X Saver A/S.

 

No matter if it came factory or from Michelin from a tire shop. I think manufacturers do the opposite, they get a target tire and tune the car for it, if anything, but probably not too much.

 

Sure, some cars get specific tires. Some models of the Explorer get a Mercedes spec tire, and some high performance cars get spec tires, but not our lowly Fusions or Escapes.

 

They stuck with the 17 inch wheel so they could put a 225 width tire on it, and not need a 235, with its increased rolling resistance. Anything to not impact that small limited EV only mileage.

 

No spare is for rear accident safety. 

[akirby]

4 minutes ago, bangster said:

A Michelin Energy X Saver A/S is a Michelin Energy X Saver A/S is a Michelin Energy X Saver A/S.

 

No matter if it came factory or from Michelin from a tire shop. I think manufacturers do the opposite, they get a target tire and tune the car for it, if anything, but probably not too much.

 

Absolutely not true.   Mfrs make multiple versions of the same tire for different vehicles/brands.   At one time there were at least 3 if not 4 different Michelin MXV4 tires depending on which vehicle you had.   All had different load ratings and other parameters.   I remember when Lincoln was developing the Lincoln LS they went through about 20 different formulas with Firestone before they got the final formulation.   They definitely don't just pick something off the rack.

[bangster]

27 minutes ago, Waldo said:

I'm just about to hit 50K miles in my 2014 Hybrid and it's time for new tires, so for me the 50K estimate is about right.  And to correct Bangster, my HEV has the 225 tires, not the 235.

Hmm, what year, because I have not seen 17 inch wheels with 225 width tires on a Titanium or any 18 inch Michelin Energy Saver A/S tires.

[akirby]

Go look at the Michelin Primacy MXM4.  They have at least 4 different versions in multiple sizes, one for Honda, one for Tesla, one for Ford.

[bangster]

So there is a 7 year run of 3 sizes of Michelin Energy Saver A/S tires only for a high volume normal consumer car that have the same wear rating, tread depth, tread pattern? hahahaha

 

And anything else will be unsafe and unworthy? hahahah

 

For 99.999999% of vehicles they are off the shelf manufacturers tires. I own a .0000001% car, Michelin and the narrow whitewall 225/60/16 for the Grand Marquis, the standard one no whitewall, but you could order them.

[bangster]

Some Michelin Energy Saver A/S have different load ratings, so yes, you need to do that.

 

Most of the MXM4 spec tires have different tread, UTQG, and often are the only ones available in that size.

 

What Fusion comes with an MXM4 in a size that isn't universal? Gen 1 had p225/50/17. 2013+ switched to the Energy Saver A/S (in that size/configuration).

 

MXM4 in p225/50/17? Zero.

MXM4 in p235/50/17? Zero

MXM4 in p235/45/18? acoustic foam and everyone else. OEM on a Fusion? NO

 

Want to pay extra for acoustic foam? Go for it, all other specs are the same, and you might want that noise abatement.

 

MXM4 in 235/40/19? Yup, Mercedes spec and everyone else. OEM on a Fusion? NO

 

Quote

 

"Hey, I want to get some tires for my Fusion Titanium with 19 inch wheels"

"okay, is that a Mercedes?"

"well, no"

"okay, we won't order the Mercedes spec tires, cool?"

 

 

I really had a similar conversation

Quote

"We show 2 Michelin Symmetry in 225/60/16"

"blackwall is fine"

"we only have 2 blackwall ones, and 3 whitewall ones"

"okay"

"???"

"put the whitewall inside"

"oh okay"

 

Edited February 11, 2020 by bangster

[drolds1]

I'm not going to tell tales out of school, but I'd listen closely to what Waldo has to say about this subject.

[bangster]

I get that some people know way more about this than I do, and that people have jobs that directly connect them to information the average joe doesn't get. I just find it ridiculous to think that they make it sound like the factory fitted tires are only available to the factory, and not on the aftermarket (which going to the stealership for replacements, that is aftermarket), any of the specific ones are available on the aftermarket. Glad my Escape doesn't have a special tread or compound or magical Ford fairy dust, I along with all the other unwashed masses that can't get these factory specials should just throw away our cars when tires are worn. Heaven forbid they are replaced with non specific tires, or tires that meet your specific needs and not a general generally good and most things tire.

 

I also think that comparing a tire with the same tread depth, wear rating, and anecdotally saying what I have gotten out of them (and stating they are different vehicle and size) is still answering to the OPs question.

 

Does the Energi come with the different tread pattern Energy Savers? Maybe, I looked at one that has 93v load rated ones, and the special tread ones are 94v, but who knows. I suppose that means that these special tread higher load rated tires are going to last 100,000 miles, and the fact I said I only got 60k is spreading of bad information, then sure.

[akirby]

Nobody here said that you could ONLY use the OEM spec tires or that the OEM spec tires weren't generally available.   They are and you can run anything with the right size,  load rating and speed rating safely.  Not sure where you got all that.   You said " A Michelin Energy X Saver A/S is a Michelin Energy X Saver A/S is a Michelin Energy X Saver A/S" and as I pointed out and as Waldo explained that simply isn't true.   There can be a lot of differences.   That's all.  If you want the exact OEM tire either the dealer or Tirerack.com can usually provide that.  If you don't care then buy whatever meets the OEm requirements.   Just understand they may ride and feel different.

 

 

[akirby]

1 hour ago, bangster said:

I get that some people know way more about this than I do, and that people have jobs that directly connect them to information the average joe doesn't get. I just find it ridiculous to think that they make it sound like the factory fitted tires are only available to the factory, and not on the aftermarket (which going to the stealership for replacements, that is aftermarket), any of the specific ones are available on the aftermarket. Glad my Escape doesn't have a special tread or compound or magical Ford fairy dust, I along with all the other unwashed masses that can't get these factory specials should just throw away our cars when tires are worn.

 

Nobody said anything remotely close to that.  You misunderstood.

[Waldo]

There's so much "insider" stuff about tires that people don't know, we could go on for ever.  I only bring it up merely to point out that you really don't have any way of knowing what you're really getting, so anecdotal conversations are all you can do and then throw in the "your results may vary".  The only definitive answer is the DOT code on the tire.  Usually you don't find that published on any of the websites, but if the DOT code on the tire you buy matches the DOT code on the tire that came on the car, that is the only way you can be sure you have a real 'matching' tire.

 

But it is a fact that probably 95% of OEM tires are specifically tuned tires.  For example the new Explorer ST has a summer tire option that is actually an off-the-shelf tire, but all the other tires available on the Explorer were custom-tuned for the Explorer.  When Ford was tuning the 2002 Thunderbird they started out using the same Michelin tire as the Lincoln LS.  But because the T-bird body structure was so different, the tire just wasn't working.  So it ended up that the two tires looked identical, but were completely different.  If you put the T-bird tire on the LS is turns into a soft marshmallow and if you put the LS tire on the T-bird it turns it into a shaky mess.  I once went into a retail tire shop and noticed 2 of those Michelin tires on the shelf, one each of the T-bird and LS tires (different DOT codes).  I asked the tire shop guy if he recognized the difference and he said no, they would just use both tires on the same car.

 

What you can actually go out and buy can vary dramatically.  In many cases on high volume cars with popular sizes, the tire manufacturers will sell the same OEM tires in retail outlets.  However often times OEMs will have quality requirements like balance specs and such.  The tires that don't meet the strict OEM specs but still meet the tire manufacturer specs will be sent to retail instead of sent to the OEM's factory.  So basically what you get at retail are the sloppy leftovers.  Other times the tire manufacturers will see that there is so much demand for a certain tire size that they can't meet retail demand with the capacity they have building the OEM tires.  So they will set up a separate production facility to build tires just for aftermarket, but they can change anything on those tires so they won't match OEM spec.  For example one tire manufacturer once told me that while they offer up to 12 different tread compounds to the OEMs, they only use 2 of those compounds in their aftermarket retail tires.

 

Another issue can be regulations.  Not sure if it's still true, but there used to be restrictions on certain tire "ingredients" like Rayon.  Tire factories in some parts of the world could use Rayon, but it was banned from being used in the US.  So some European cars would come in to the US with tires that had Rayon in them, but any aftermarket tire made in the US could not have that Rayon.  So the tires would either have to be imported, or substituted with something made locally that was slightly different.

 

So yes your Escape does have magical Ford fairy dust in the tires, but you may or may not be able to get the same thing in the aftermarket when it's time to replace them.