1.5l cylinder 4 misfiring after spark plug and coil packs replaced

[Ironblacksmith702]

I have a 2015 fusion and I was throwing a cylinder 4 misfire code. I changed the spark plugs and coil packs and it's still doing it. Any ideas on what it could be now?

[bbf2530]

28 minutes ago, Ironblacksmith702 said:

I have a 2015 fusion and I was throwing a cylinder 4 misfire code. I changed the spark plugs and coil packs and it's still doing it. Any ideas on what it could be now?

 

Hi Iron. Blind Internet diagnosis? You already replaced the plugs and coil pack. So...two other possibilities are a bad injector or a failing PCM (hope it's not that)?

 

You can try swapping the suspect injector with another and see if the fault moves with it. If not, it may be the PCM. But again, this is only blind Internet diagnosis.

 

EDIT- Is your 2015 Fusion still within the 5 year/60,000 mile Powertrain Warranty? I realize it is a long shot.

 

Let us know how you make out and good luck.

Edited June 23, 2021 by bbf2530

[drolds1]

You've already asked this question here and got one answer.  Please don't start a parallel thread for the same topic.  The other thread will now be closed, and the discussion can continue here.

[Ironblacksmith702]

1 hour ago, bbf2530 said:

 

Hi Iron. Blind Internet diagnosis? You already replaced the plugs and coil pack. So...two other possibilities are a bad injector or a failing PCM (hope it's not that)?

 

You can try swapping the suspect injector with another and see if the fault moves with it. If not, it may be the PCM. But again, this is only blind Internet diagnosis.

 

EDIT- Is your 2015 Fusion still within the 5 year/60,000 mile Powertrain Warranty? I realize it is a long shot.

 

Let us know how you make out and good luck.

No it has 61k miles on it so it's just out of the warranty unfortunately 

[Ironblacksmith702]

Well I took my car to the mechanic. And it is worse than I was expecting. It has a blown head gasket. Thankfully the dealer I just bought it from. Sounds like he wants to make it right so hopefully that will take most of the cost out of it.

[Ironblacksmith702]

Took it to the ford dealer today. They are saying there is probably coolant in the engine block and it has caused damage. So it's going to need a new lower part of the engine. Does anyone know if there is a recall or something along those lines for stuff like this? Is this caused my poor maintenence or is it a manufacturing defect? I shouldn't have to replace the engine at 61k miles. 

[akirby]

It’s a defective block design.  It would not qualify for a recall and there is no extended warranty at this time.  Your dealer should work with you to cover at least part of the expense so close to the warranty expiration.

[drolds1]

Akirby is correct.  There was a design flaw in the 1.5EB engine which allowed coolant to leak into the cylinders.  He's further correct in that there's no extended warranty or "recall."   Recalls are reserved for safety-related issues, which this is not.  Ford will replace the long block  under the terms or the original B2B warranty, the 5/60 powertrain warranty or an ESP.  TSB 20-2100 was issued covering this scenario. See this post for further information. This is a well-known problem.

 

I agree that your dealer should intervene on your behalf.  Ford should pick up at least part of the cost for you at just 1K miles past the warranty. 

 

You should also be aware that there was a pending class action lawsuit for this pending as of 12/20.  Read.

[19TitaniumAWD]

On 7/1/2021 at 9:55 PM, Ironblacksmith702 said:

Took it to the ford dealer today. They are saying there is probably coolant in the engine block and it has caused damage. So it's going to need a new lower part of the engine. Does anyone know if there is a recall or something along those lines for stuff like this? Is this caused my poor maintenence or is it a manufacturing defect? I shouldn't have to replace the engine at 61k miles. 

 

Dealing with this myself. My 19 TItanium 2.0 AWD has coolant intrusion into all 4 cylinders. Smokes like crazy and misfires on start (usually takes a long time to actually start), has gone from 31mpg to about 17mpg almost overnight when this started, has a P0301 code. It's got 400 miles left on the warranty (59,598 miles) and after having to FORCE them to look at it (had it on the list 1,200 miles ago, they drug their feet I assume hoping to get it out of warranty as when I stopped in weeks later to follow up, it magically wasn't on any list and the service advisor on duty that day had no idea who I was or what I was talking about, car wasn't in the system at all) they did the pressure leak test, it lost nearly all pressure after 2 hours, when they put the scope in there was coolant standing in all 4 cylinders with the worst by far being cylinder 1. They ordered a long block and said due to COVID, it'll be a several month backorder and to keep driving it as it's our only transportation. Pretty concerned though, I can't imagine passing that much coolant (I have to fill the reservoir twice daily) through the motor, turbo and exhaust isn't damaging other things (turbo? converter? Valvetrain?). It's going to be a fight every step of the way I have no doubt getting everything checked/covered if damaged. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by 19TitaniumAWD

[bbf2530]

2 hours ago, 19TitaniumAWD said:

 

Dealing with this myself. My 19 TItanium 2.0 AWD has coolant intrusion into all 4 cylinders. Smokes like crazy and misfires on start (usually takes a long time to actually start), has gone from 31mpg to about 17mpg almost overnight when this started, has a P0301 code. It's got 400 miles left on the warranty (59,598 miles) and after having to FORCE them to look at it (had it on the list 1,200 miles ago, they drug their feet I assume hoping to get it out of warranty as when I stopped in weeks later to follow up, it magically wasn't on any list and the service advisor on duty that day had no idea who I was or what I was talking about, car wasn't in the system at all) they did the pressure leak test, it lost nearly all pressure after 2 hours, when they put the scope in there was coolant standing in all 4 cylinders with the worst by far being cylinder 1. They ordered a long block and said due to COVID, it'll be a several month backorder and to keep driving it as it's our only transportation. Pretty concerned though, I can't imagine passing that much coolant (I have to fill the reservoir twice daily) through the motor, turbo and exhaust isn't damaging other things (turbo? converter? Valvetrain?). It's going to be a fight every step of the way I have no doubt getting everything checked/covered if damaged. 

 

Hi 19T. Gather all your Invoices, Work Orders etc. from the previous visits concerning this problem, and call Ford Customer Relations.

 

If you do not have the copies, immediately go to the Dealership and get them (Always get copies of all Work Orders/Invoices when we have work performed.

 

Inform Customer relations of the issue and your concerns. See what they say/offer. If not offered, ask if they will provide a courtesy loaner, due to the Covid induced long wait.

 

Also ask for E-mail verification of your conversations, a Case #, any updates etc. In this way, you are covered with a paper trail if anything worse should happen while you are waiting for parts.

 

Let us know how you make out and good luck.

[19TitaniumAWD]

19 hours ago, bbf2530 said:

 

Hi 19T. Gather all your Invoices, Work Orders etc. from the previous visits concerning this problem, and call Ford Customer Relations.

 

If you do not have the copies, immediately go to the Dealership and get them (Always get copies of all Work Orders/Invoices when we have work performed.

 

Inform Customer relations of the issue and your concerns. See what they say/offer. If not offered, ask if they will provide a courtesy loaner, due to the Covid induced long wait.

 

Also ask for E-mail verification of your conversations, a Case #, any updates etc. In this way, you are covered with a paper trail if anything worse should happen while you are waiting for parts.

 

Let us know how you make out and good luck.

 

Would do, but the official diagnosis was the first visit. I stopped in to make them aware of the issue a long time ago, they said "We can't start on it right now. It will take months to get the part, we have to tear the motor down and take photos to get this started and we have no loaners available.". Well, I can't be without transportation for months on end with no idea when it'll get fixed, and I am not paying $1,600 a month for an undetermined period on a rental car. So I asked what else we can do? They said they could write my info down, they wouldn't put it in the system because if it is and it's not addressed in 30 days Ford would close it forever and they'd get ahold of me in a week or so about a loaner since I was around a thousand miles from the end of warranty. Weeks later I stopped back in, and that's when I found out I wasn't on any list, the service advisor that day was not one I had spoken to initially, and she had no idea who I was, what I was talking about and actually walked me to the post board and I wasn't anywhere on it. So she added me, but I went to the service manager and complained. Now even closer on warranty he understood, and he had no idea why they told me the motor had to be torn down. He explained that all the loaners are with other customers who have been waiting months for parts and I'm at the bottom of the list, but they could diagnose it (using the pressure test and a scope) and open an RO so that I could keep driving it regardless of the mileage until they get the parts in. At that point it would take a day or two to put the long block in, and I said I don't mind renting a car if it's for a day or few but I wasn't doing it for months.

We have been communicating by email about it, and will continue to do so with any updates. This has soured us though. We had a 2012 Focus and had a similarly hard time for nearly 80,000 miles before they finally addresses our transmission issue. And we had to force it then, even had to go to court with a dealer about it. Tired of fighting with Ford dealers on taking care of their obligations. 

 

I feel horrible for anyone that goes over 60.000 and has this engine issue. It's a nightmare even when it's fully covered.

 

Edit: Do you mean customer relations through the dealership? Or Ford directly? If the latter, how do I reach out to them?

Edited July 8, 2021 by 19TitaniumAWD

[bbf2530]

6 hours ago, 19TitaniumAWD said:

 

Would do, but the official diagnosis was the first visit. I stopped in to make them aware of the issue a long time ago, they said "We can't start on it right now. It will take months to get the part, we have to tear the motor down and take photos to get this started and we have no loaners available.". Well, I can't be without transportation for months on end with no idea when it'll get fixed, and I am not paying $1,600 a month for an undetermined period on a rental car. So I asked what else we can do? They said they could write my info down, they wouldn't put it in the system because if it is and it's not addressed in 30 days Ford would close it forever and they'd get ahold of me in a week or so about a loaner since I was around a thousand miles from the end of warranty. Weeks later I stopped back in, and that's when I found out I wasn't on any list, the service advisor that day was not one I had spoken to initially, and she had no idea who I was, what I was talking about and actually walked me to the post board and I wasn't anywhere on it. So she added me, but I went to the service manager and complained. Now even closer on warranty he understood, and he had no idea why they told me the motor had to be torn down. He explained that all the loaners are with other customers who have been waiting months for parts and I'm at the bottom of the list, but they could diagnose it (using the pressure test and a scope) and open an RO so that I could keep driving it regardless of the mileage until they get the parts in. At that point it would take a day or two to put the long block in, and I said I don't mind renting a car if it's for a day or few but I wasn't doing it for months.

We have been communicating by email about it, and will continue to do so with any updates. This has soured us though. We had a 2012 Focus and had a similarly hard time for nearly 80,000 miles before they finally addresses our transmission issue. And we had to force it then, even had to go to court with a dealer about it. Tired of fighting with Ford dealers on taking care of their obligations. 

 

I feel horrible for anyone that goes over 60.000 and has this engine issue. It's a nightmare even when it's fully covered.

 

Edit: Do you mean customer relations through the dealership? Or Ford directly? If the latter, how do I reach out to them?

 

Hi 19T. Do you have copies of any paperwork/Repair Orders/Work Orders/Invoices etc?

 

There's is a lot to unpack in your previous post, but let's just go from here. Suffice it to say...to everyone in the future...Always get everything in writing. Get a copy of a RO (Repair Order)/Work Order/Invoice. Some version of "We will write your info down, but won't put it in the system because..." is not good enough, especially when so close to the end of your warranty.

 

To answer your last question: Contact Ford Customer Relations, not the Dealership. The phone number is in the Owners Manual, the Warranty Handbook, etc. If you do not have your hard copies, you can download the PDF versions here: https://www.fleet.ford.com/parts-service/resources/owner-manuals/

 

Just for informational purposes: By Federal Law,  Auto Dealerships are individual franchises, and the auto manufacturers have limited influence on how the Dealerships do business. So whenever you have an unresolved issue with a Dealership, contact the Customer Relations Department of the manufacturer. In this case, get Ford involved directly by doing what I recommended in my previous reply.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

Edited July 8, 2021 by bbf2530

[drolds1]

If there are no loaners available, they should pay for a rental car, then, although there probably aren't any of those available right now either.  Ford once paid for a rental for 9 weeks, and that was for a Mercury Sable, not a Lincoln product.

[19TitaniumAWD]

6 hours ago, bbf2530 said:

 

Hi 19T. Do you have copies of any paperwork/Repair Orders/Work Orders/Invoices etc?

 

There's is a lot to unpack in your previous post, but let's just go from here. Suffice it to say...to everyone in the future...Always get everything in writing. Get a copy of a RO (Repair Order)/Work Order/Invoice. Some version of "We will write your info down, but won't put it in the system because..." is not good enough, especially when so close to the end of your warranty.

 

To answer your last question: Contact Ford Customer Relations, not the Dealership. The phone number is in the Owners Manual, the Warranty Handbook, etc. If you do not have your hard copies, you can download the PDF versions here: https://www.fleet.ford.com/parts-service/resources/owner-manuals/

 

Just for informational purposes: By Federal Law,  Auto Dealerships are individual franchises, and the auto manufacturers have limited influence on how the Dealerships do business. So whenever you have an unresolved issue with a Dealership, contact the Customer Relations Department of the manufacturer. In this case, get Ford involved directly by doing what I recommended in my previous reply.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

 

I do from the initial visit (which was the official diagnosis). I learned the hard way after them telling me I'd be on the list and hear from them the following Monday and then coming to find out nothing was ever even written down. It's DEFINITELY in the system now, I have the RO, invoice, etc.

 

Gotcha, I'll do that tomorrow. Wish I'd have thought of that on our 2012 Focus, having to take them to court was a slam dunk but it was stressful and completely unnecessary. Something I'd rather not repeat here.

 

3 hours ago, drolds1 said:

If there are no loaners available, they should pay for a rental car, then, although there probably aren't any of those available right now either.  Ford once paid for a rental for 9 weeks, and that was for a Mercury Sable, not a Lincoln product.

 

There aren't, and to be fair they're not lying. They lied about a fair bit, but not that. Their lot is empty. But the Enterprise and Hertz here are full, I actually rented one while it was being tested and diagnosed because it's my only transportation and I absolutely could not miss work for it. I was pretty salty paying $115 for 12 hours but I was so done, couldn't argue it on my timeline at the moment and that was that. That was what initially had me so ticked off with the dealer as well. Telling me to diagnose it properly they'd have to tear it apart for photos and I'd be without it for months and the only alternative was to pay $1,600 monthly for a rental was what got me up the service manager's nose and finally got them to at least get it on the rack, get it diagnosed and get the parts ordered. 

[Ironblacksmith702]

Ford isn't willing to cover anything. I'm wondering if I could drop a 2.5l ecoboost in it instead of the 1.5l?

Also if I put some head gasket sealer in the car would that be a good enough bandaid to fix it for a while so I can drive it around until I figure out what I'm going to do?

Edited July 15, 2021 by Ironblacksmith702

[bbf2530]

1 hour ago, Ironblacksmith702 said:

Ford isn't willing to cover anything. I'm wondering if I could drop a 2.5l ecoboost in it instead of the 1.5l?

Also if I put some head gasket sealer in the car would that be a good enough bandaid to fix it for a while so I can drive it around until I figure out what I'm going to do?

 

Hi Ironblacksmith. When you say "Ford isn't willing to cover anything.", what exactly do you mean? Did you contact Ford Customer Relations, or are you relying solely on what the Dealer Service Department told you?

 

If you have not called and opened a case with Ford Customer Relations, do so now. Have all your work invoices and receipts ready when you call.

 

On a related note: There is no "2.5l ecoboost". Only a 2.5L I-4 non EcoBoost engine. The largest I-4 EcoBoost engine in the Fusion was the 2.0L I-4 EcoBoost. Then there was the 2.7L V-6 EcoBoost available in the Fusion Sport model.

And I can not blind Internet guess whether gasket sealer would give you some breathing room while you decide what to do.

 

Keep us updated and good luck.

[Ironblacksmith702]

Yea I opened a claim with them and they ate the ones that told me they would not cover it. 

[bbf2530]

8 minutes ago, Ironblacksmith702 said:

Yea I opened a claim with them and they ate the ones that told me they would not cover it. 

 

Hi Ironblacksmith. First...don't accept the first no for an answer. Ask to have you case/claim bumped up the chain of command. Politely but firmly show them you will keep fighting this as long as you can.

 

Next...In your earlier posts, you stated that you brought your car back to the Dealer and, "Thankfully the dealer I just bought it from. Sounds like he wants to make it right so hopefully that will take most of the cost out of it." Has  the Dealer now also stated they will do nothing to help?

 

Good luck.

Edited July 15, 2021 by bbf2530

[Ironblacksmith702]

They will still do something but aren't willing to cover the 5700 bucks they quoted me to fix it. They aren't even willing to cover half

[Ironblacksmith702]

Car is getting engine swapped. The dealer I bought it from is paying for half of the engine and labor. So it's only going to cost me about $1,700. Here is hoping I won't have any more issues with this newer engine.